The Pressure to Push Through: Eli Teel on Eating Disorder Recovery as a Trans College Student

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Ellie Pike:
Hi.

Shannon Kopp:
Hi, Elie. How are you?

Ellie Pike:
It's so good to see you. I'm really excited to record this episode with you.

Shannon Kopp:
Me too. I'm stoked.

Ellie Pike:
Well, so I think our listeners are probably already cluing in that today's format is just a little bit different. And that's all thanks to you, Shannon. And I'm so grateful we've worked together for a long time and you've had your own little niche and today's an opportunity for us to just combine our passions. So can you tell us a little bit about why we're having this conversation and where we're headed?

Shannon Kopp:
So as you know, I've been working on Say It Brave on Campus and meeting with just the most incredible mental health advocates and students for four years. And their stories are so beautiful and so important and so authentic and really so needed. There's still so much stigma around mental health today that I wanted to get them out there in a new creative way. So I pitched a miniseries to you, one where I could actually jump into the host chair and bring three different recovery stories from college students to the world. And you agreed and now we're here.

Ellie Pike:
Shannon, I'm so glad you did because I'm sure our listeners get a little bit tired of hearing just my voice. And I think a fresh new perspective and one that especially speaks to breaking stigma, especially on a college campus, will be so well received. So before we jump in, I think it's really important to note your own background. What brought you to the world of eating disorder recovery?

Shannon Kopp:
I developed an eating disorder in high school and I thought I was the only person in the world who was struggling in the way that I was. And that continued all throughout college. And I carried such shame and secrecy over this illness, not realizing how many other people are struggling and that this was never a choice. So once I got into recovery, I met so many other people that shared similar stories and soon developed Say It Brave and Say It Brave on Campus. And all of us are just really passionate about ending mental health stigma and helping people with mental health challenges and eating disorders feel less alone.

Ellie Pike:
Thank you so much for being a voice of advocacy for folks who need it and for bringing stories to light. So jumping on in, who do we have first and what's so great about them for this interview?

Shannon Kopp:
So our first podcast features Eli Thiel, and I love Eli so much. There's just so much to say about who he is, what he's overcome, and what he stands for. But Eli is a queer transgender man. He's gone through treatment at ERC a few times and is just really passionate about sharing his recovery story and ending mental health stigma. He's also a UC Davis grad with a focus on psychology. And I find every time I listen to Eli, I feel lighter, I feel less alone, I feel empowered to speak up more when it comes to mental health advocacy and also LGBTQ+ advocacy. So what really stood out to me with Eli's story is that like so many of us, he was terrified to get more help and he was afraid of stopping his life. And that is exactly how I felt like I'd be stopping my life if I went to treatment when in reality doing that was the source of all the places my life grew and blossomed.

But at the time it just felt like, "I can't, I have to find a way to do this on my own." And Eli felt that too. And he eventually though found the courage to get support and then he found the courage again to get support. And nowadays, he's just really proactive about his mental health. He's checking in with himself and saying, "What do I need to care for myself?" And he's acknowledging the things that he went through, the things he continues to go through, and where he needs support. And rather than waiting until things hit the fan and get really tough, he proactively supports himself. And I think this is how I'm trying to live as well, just trying to check in with myself in the same way you check in with yourself physically. "How am I feeling mentally? Where do I need support? Where do I need community?" And Eli's filling up his life with those sources of support and I think it's amazing.

Ellie Pike:
Well, he sounds very inspiring and I am so excited to listen to the interview. So, Shannon, there's only one thing left for you to do. And so you have to say the line.

Shannon Kopp:
You're listening to Mental Note Podcast and I'm Shannon Kopp.

Ellie Pike:
That's my favorite.

Shannon Kopp:
Welcome, Eli, to the podcast. We're so happy to have you.

Eli Teel:
I'm so excited to be here.

Shannon Kopp:
I have enjoyed getting to know you through Say It Brave on Campus. And I wondered if you could take our listeners through your journey of transitioning from high school to college and all that your freshman year brought about and what you experienced.

Eli Teel:
Yeah, definitely. It was quite the transition. I definitely grew up in high school pushing and pushing and pushing myself, didn't really have much room for rest. So I was just trying to squeeze myself into a box that I thought I was supposed to be in, but when I got to college, it exploded everywhere and I did not see it coming. And I just started to realize so many things about myself around my gender, my sexuality, just deep mental health issues that I didn't really realize were there. And so it was a rocky, really rocky first quarter. I was really struggling with my mental health in general and it was having a big impact on my whole social circle, my family, my friends. And unfortunately, that's when my eating disorder stepped in and said, "How about you put all your energy over here? It'll disturb people less and it'll make people like you better," which was a false promise, I now know. But that was really what I turned to.

Shannon Kopp:
The way you just spoke to the eating disorder voice was powerful because isn't that what it sounds like, just this false promise I think you referred to like, "Just focus your energy over here." And you said it would be less disruptive, could kind of be secretive, and you started to follow that voice. And when did you start to develop an awareness that it was offering false promises and there was a lot more harm than good coming from the eating disorder?

Eli Teel:
It didn't take long because at first it was more of just an awareness of what I was eating and I started counting calories, but it wasn't damaging my physical health yet, but it got to a point where, honestly, before it started damaging my physical health, I felt it emotionally. It was just so all-consuming. And I think that was the scariest part and how quickly it became all-consuming.

Shannon Kopp:
Yeah, I experienced that too. I remember just this feeling of shock that a few months ago I had these interests and I had these activities, and then enter eating disorder and how it makes our life smaller and our mental capacity smaller because it demands all of our focus.

And so I know that seeking treatment for an eating disorder is a big decision that requires a ton of courage and can be really difficult to make as a student in the middle of your schooling. Can you walk us through your thought process and how you found that courage to seek help?

Eli Teel:
Yeah, I first entered treatment, I just did an intensive outpatient and I made the decision in 2020, so this was all in the midst of COVID, made the decision to go to IOP because I just reached a point where I just felt so consumed by it that it was just exhausting me. And before I started that program was the first time that I had ever fessed up to my parents and told them what I was struggling with. And I always say that it was harder to come out as having an eating disorder than it was to come out as trans and queer. And that really goes to show the amount of internalized shame that comes from an eating disorder because those other things, it felt like who I am, but this felt like my fault. So it was really challenging to bring it up and be honest about it. I'm really glad I did and that was my introduction to eating disorder support in general.

And I was stubborn and wanted to get on with my college experience, so I finished the program. It was the end of the quarter and I was set on starting back up again next quarter, despite recommendations from the treatment team there, which I hear that so much. Now that I've been doing advocacy work and talking to more people, there's such a resistance to staying in treatment and putting school on pause because of all the societal pressure. But I definitely learned that the earlier you commit to recovery, the easier it is to face those problems, because year after year, it just gets more and more ingrained.

Shannon Kopp:
Yeah, totally. I mean, of course you wanted to just be done like, "Okay, I did that and I'm done." I mean, that is a natural feeling and sometimes we just need more. And we know eating disorders are not a choice. And you can have this intellectual knowledge too. You can have every therapist and person and advocate tell you, "This is not a choice. There's genetics involved, trauma, biopsychosocial factors," and yet still there is this deeply ingrained shame like, "Well, why can't I just change? I can apply myself in these areas. Why can't I do it here?" And the shame perpetuates the eating disorder. And so it must have been really challenging to know you'd taken this step and then to realize you needed more support, how did you come to terms with that and find the support?

Eli Teel:
Yeah, I fortunately was semi-regular check-ins with my doctor on campus. I switched over to their healthcare and it was great, honestly. It was really quality healthcare. And I kind of was just in this like, I don't know if I'd call it a stalemate, but me and my doctor, he did not want me to finish out the school year, really, really did not. And there were moments where he was like, "Ethically, this is getting a little iffy. You really need to be in a higher level of treatment." But somehow I just pushed and pushed and pushed it off because I was so set on finishing. And by the time I finished my sophomore year, I was a mess. It was a really, really low point for me. And that was my promise. I was like, "I promise that I will go right into treatment as quickly as possible once I finish school."

And yeah, that was my first time in residential treatment. After I did my first round of residential treatment, I flew to Chicago for PHP through ERC. So that was my first experience with ERC. And I loved the PHP. It's very intensive every day, all day. And for me, I needed that. I needed that accountability and it ended up working out really well for me.

Shannon Kopp:
Yeah, totally. I remember experiencing this weird feeling when I was in residential and PHP of I thought I would feel trapped or like, yeah, because certain things I could do yesterday before treatment I couldn't do, but I actually felt like this freedom because I was finally protected in a way. I had this whole team and this intensity around recovery that I had never had before. And I was like, "Oh my God, I'm actually not alone in this for once and how have I been doing this for so long?"

Eli Teel:
It has always been such a feeling of relief whenever I get into intensive treatment.

Shannon Kopp:
Yeah. And just it would be great if it could be an easy thing we could do on our own. It's a horrible experience having an eating disorder. And so I'm grateful you had the courage and you were able to get that care. And then at the same time, you were learning a lot about yourself. And can you share with us about transitioning and walk us through what that was like and learnings that you had, not only in school, but in treatment that helped you kind of move closer and closer to the truest version of you and away from not only the eating disorder, but perhaps other boxes, you mentioned boxes, you had kind of just been in growing up and then realizing, "Wait, who am I actually? What do I love? What do I want?" And kind of how recovery supported your journey in exploring those questions.

Eli Teel:
Yeah, for sure. My eating disorder, there was so much interplay between my eating disorder and my transition because I experienced a lot of gender dysphoria and along with being a coping mechanism, my eating disorder was what I was using to feel more affirmed in my body. In my mind, any kind of curves was making me look too feminine and I wasn't going to pass as male. And so I just started dropping weight because I wanted to look more masculine. That was a slippery slope, we'll call it. And that honestly fueled my eating all the way through, to be honest. It wasn't until I had been on hormones for maybe four years that I genuinely trusted my body to look the way that I felt it did, because it takes several years for the body to really adjust.

And once I felt male, which is so hard to articulate, but I just felt male. I don't know how else to say it, but that was a really big part of my recovery, is trusting my body to put the mass where I felt comfortable with it being. And I'd say when I was in Chicago, most of what I was struggling with was a lot of just self-hatred and anger at the world for being trans. It's a big burden. It's expensive. It's a lot of work to get care. Care's not very accessible. There's insurance coverage to worry about. All these approvals to get surgeries and hormones. It's a really, really challenging process.

I realize now looking back that all of my stages of treatment were to work on different things. When I was in the midst of it, I just felt like I was failing one round of treatment after another. "Why am I not getting better? Why do I relapse every time I get to a somewhat stable place?" And yeah, I had so many different things to work through. I think at first I just had to come to terms with being trans and stop being so ashamed and angry about it before I could even start working on my eating disorder because I didn't value myself and I didn't have enough self-worth to really be motivated to work on my eating disorder. And then second round of treatment, it was more like, "Okay, let's actually address the eating disorder behaviors and kind of interfere with that." And I'd say the final step was more acknowledging what in my life led to my eating disorder, where all of that came from, the trauma from childhood. And there's just so many factors.

Shannon Kopp:
Yeah. I mean, I just feel proud. I feel really proud of you when it sounds like making peace with your gender identity and who you were was a crucial first step. And I guess I'm wondering what thoughts you have for people that are going through similar things, a mental health challenge, but also struggling maybe with transitioning or struggling with their gender identity or sexuality, what words you would tell them?

Eli Teel:
It really turns into a monster when there's so many contributing factors. I look back and think about how I was in treatment and transitioning and finished college relatively on time. I have no idea how I did that. And to anyone who is going through that right now, I'm proud and it's really brave, but also take it easy. Sometimes what you really need to do is put school on hold, and that is such a fear for everyone, honestly. There's that stigma around, "Oh, once you stop, you'll never go back." And just so much pressure. And I did it, but it burnt me out so bad. Honestly, since college, I had to spend two years really, just my full-time job was taking care of myself. And after those couple years, I've spent another two years learning how to live again and be a person in the world.

It's such a wild experience being an eating disorder treatment and adjusting from 24/7 care in a controlled environment where everyone makes decisions for you. And then you go out in the big world and it's like, "Oh my God, I have to make so many decisions for myself and I don't have constant care." And I really just have to relearn how to live independently.

Shannon Kopp:
And so you kept going, you kept going in transitioning, in eating disorder recovery. Now here you are today. Can you share with us the ways you continue to take care of yourself and protect your recovery or prioritize your recovery? And I know from speaking with you that one of those ways has been speaking to patients at ERC. And so I'd love to just hear more about your recovery today and also just what fills your cup.

Eli Teel:
Yeah, definitely. And I love talking about it because it's a good reminder for myself too. Like you said, doing advocacy and speaking to people about my recovery has been so helpful, not only just to keep it fresh in my mind, but it just keeps my commitment to recovery alive. The eating disorder voice doesn't go away. It just gets easier to manage and quieter. Your healthy voice gets much louder than the eating disorder voice. And when I have an eating disorder thought, it's telling me, "Put less cheese on your food or don't eat that cookie because you ate this today." I'm just like, I'm going out there and telling everyone about my recovery and how important it is and I can't listen to my eating disorder voice. I can't listen to an eating disorder thought.

Shannon Kopp:
I think it's brilliant. You're right. There's the voice of you. And I mean, it takes so much work to become unglued to the eating disorder voice so you have enough distance to actually witness what it's saying to you. And it sounds like that's what's happening in your life today, that you have some distance inside. You can take a few steps back from it and then examine that thought and go, "Do I really want to do that?"

Eli Teel:
Yeah. And sometimes I'll unconsciously give in to an eating disorder thought before I even think about it. And then I sit there and I'm like, "Wait, who made this decision? How did we get here?" And the biggest part of my recovery has been going back, adding more cheese, acting opposite to what my eating disorder voice is saying, even once it's made a decision for me.

I'd say the biggest thing that has helped me maintain my recovery has been letting it be my life and be my job. If I could recommend something to anyone that's getting out of treatment and has been in treatment on and off for years, slow down, slow down your life, make recovery your full-time job. Because for me, I was privileged enough to have a support system where I was able to have my needs taken care of. I had a place to live, I had money for food, I didn't have to worry about all those things. And it totally just let me relax and decompress and just recover from that treatment burnout. And it was so, so important.

And now I'm at a point where I recently got set up for outpatient care just so that I can make sure that I'm staying on track with my recovery because life has presented many problems in the last year living in a new city, had to find a job. It was a lot. And I recently learned about my neurodivergence, autism, and ADHD, and that can present a whole 'nother wave of challenges with eating. And so any struggles that I have lately is more out of a lack of energy to stick to my recovery rather than a desire to restrict. I need someone to just keep an eye on me to make sure that it's not taking me too far away from my recovery.

Shannon Kopp:
Totally. And it sounds like you've worked hard to create this life and to be who you are and honor yourself. And so you're bringing in more support to help you keep doing that.

Eli Teel:
Yeah, definitely. It was a very weird experience to reach back out for eating disorder care when I was at such a different place because I'm so used to coming into those phone calls and coming into those vitals checks in such an awful place with my eating disorder. It was hard not to... I don't know. It started to feel a little bit like a failure to reach back out for care, but I really just had to remind myself that I wasn't struggling. I was putting something in place so that if I do start to struggle, I have the support and I'm aware of it and I can jump right on top of it and not let it take anything away from me because my recovery is my life now. It's my career. That's what I want to do.

Advocacy and speaking on panels is... I'm just so passionate about it and it has really grounded me. I'm finally doing better. And I think a big part of it is that I have a purpose now and my recovery is central to that. And I've learned that I can't live my life the way I want to live it unless I'm in accordance with my recovery. So it's not even an option at this point.

Shannon Kopp:
Totally. And I think for so many, especially students listening, there is this idea that, "I have to be in crisis to get help," but often it's like navigating all the windy, weird shit that life presents and just making the decision that like, "I'm going to continue," like you said, "To prioritize my recovery however that looks." And it's not easy, but you keep doing it.

Eli Teel:
Yeah. And like you had mentioned earlier about community, that has been so important to me. I'm part of an alumni recovery group and having that community has been so, so helpful. The longer I get out of treatment, the more the diet culture tries to infiltrate my brain. Oh my God, the diet culture in this world right now is overwhelming and awful and everywhere. And so to be able to once a week sit down with other people that are relatively new in their recovery and just remind ourselves, all of that is crap. None of it is true. And just to be able to talk about how that's impacting us and then talk back to that voice that society is trying to put in our heads about be smaller, eat less, all those little diet fads. It's just insane. And so it's really important to me to connect with other people that are going through that too, because you can really start to feel alone when diet culture is so big.

Shannon Kopp:
Totally. And to connect with people that have seen you at your truest and vulnerable and real, and to have those kind of real conversations, which are the opposite of diet culture. And so I'm wondering if you could go back in time maybe to yourself freshman year or at any point actually when you were struggling, what would you tell yourself?

Eli Teel:
Honestly, we talk about knowing ourselves better than anyone else, but sometimes eating disorder gets in the way with that. And especially in the beginning of treatment, I wish I had listened to the professionals. It's so hard because we have a very set picture of how we want to live our lives and eating disorder treatment is not part of it. And it sounds generic like, "Listen to the professionals," but genuinely they're there for a reason and eating disorders treatment has been established for a reason. And I think treatment can be a much smoother process if you start listening from the beginning.

Shannon Kopp:
It's such a joy to connect with you and to witness your growth and courage and the way your advocacy changes lives, mine included, Eli. So thanks for spending time on the podcast today. We are the luckiest to have gotten to chat with you.

Eli Teel:
And I'm just so grateful to be in a place where I'm getting my life back and stepping back into the world and building up the strength to make changes.

Shannon Kopp:
You're amazing, Eli. I'm grateful you're in that place too.

Eli's story reminds us that recovery is not a box to be checked so you can get onto your other plans. Taking time off, asking for more help, returning to treatment, or starting again, does not erase the work you've already done. It builds on it. So if you're a student questioning whether it's too soon or too inconvenient to get help, let this be your permission to slow down and choose yourself. And if this episode resonated with you, stay with us. This is just the beginning of our College Mental Health Miniseries. We have two more coming your way over the next few days.

Thank you for listening to Mental Note Podcast. Our show is brought to you by Eating Recovery Center and Pathlight Mood & Anxiety Center. If you'd like to talk to a trained therapist to see if in-person or virtual treatment is right for you, please call them at (877) 850-7199. If you need a free college age support group, check out eatingrecovery.com/support-groups or pathlightbh.com/support-groups. Mental Note is hosted by me, Shannon Kopp, produced by Elie Pike, edited by Carrie Daniels, and directed by Sam Pike. Till next time.

The Pressure to Push Through: Eli Teel on Eating Disorder Recovery as a Trans College Student

Transcript